South Island Wargaming, New Zealand.

South Island Wargaming, New Zealand.

 
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 Post subject: help a guy out
PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2011 8:56 pm 
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hay guy im just getting in to painting my figures and was wondering what paint everyone uses and where they get it from also what brush sizes, I was look at the GW stuff and they not cheap Im in christchurch painting ogres

thanks for the help


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 Post subject: Re: help a guy out
PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2011 9:05 pm 
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Location: You must be the jesus of gaming, you can turn wargaming into whine.
I bring my own paint brushes into the country and sell them locally. I use them myself and stand by their quality. Paints wise I only use Vallejo and P3. P3 has to be sourced overseas, but Vallejo FoW colours can be bought from Comics Compulsion. Also Acorn stocks Vallejo game colours which I am slowly converting my GW colours too.

GW paints are currently a waste of time due to the quantity, quality and cost.

I hope that helps some what.

(Waits for Malekith to have a pro GW rant)

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Warpmaster wrote:
I don't beleave you AJ, we all know your a computer that shoots wonderfully painted mini's out of your butt every day

Javelin wrote:
You'll have to let us know when you're next back so that we can have AJCon.


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 Post subject: Re: help a guy out
PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2011 9:07 pm 
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Hey AJ, where (website) do you source your P3 paints from? Direct from Privateer Press? Or is there a better place?

cheers, Craig

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 Post subject: Re: help a guy out
PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2011 9:08 pm 
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AJ sells a good range of well priced brushes, as for paints it depends greatly on your painting style. I like GW metalics and washes (from Comics), but prefer the P3 range for the rest of my colours as they offer better coverage and don't need to be watered (I get them from online stores like Maelstrom and Firestorm games).


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 Post subject: Re: help a guy out
PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2011 10:10 pm 
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Ive heard good things bout Vallejo paints, what are they worth? also AJ how much you sell your brushes for?


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 Post subject: Re: help a guy out
PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2011 10:23 pm 
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I quite like the Vallejo range for highlighting but they tend not to have much coverage for basecoats. I imagine they'd be great for blending, but I prefer to avoid such time consuming techniques. I have too much to paint!


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 Post subject: Re: help a guy out
PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2011 10:30 pm 
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Location: You must be the jesus of gaming, you can turn wargaming into whine.
frosty wrote:
Ive heard good things bout Vallejo paints, what are they worth? also AJ how much you sell your brushes for?


$10ea for the size 0, 00 & 000 brushes
$12 for the 1/4" flat head brush
$15 for the 3/4" flat head brush

I can do deals for bulk purchases.

I got my P3 paint sets from Comics originally, the individual ones I get from Maelstrom.

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Warpmaster wrote:
I don't beleave you AJ, we all know your a computer that shoots wonderfully painted mini's out of your butt every day

Javelin wrote:
You'll have to let us know when you're next back so that we can have AJCon.


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 Post subject: Re: help a guy out
PostPosted: Tue Aug 16, 2011 11:32 pm 
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AJ wrote:
frosty wrote:
Ive heard good things bout Vallejo paints, what are they worth? also AJ how much you sell your brushes for?


$10ea for the size 0, 00 & 000 brushes
$12 for the 1/4" flat head brush
$15 for the 3/4" flat head brush

I can do deals for bulk purchases.

I got my P3 paint sets from Comics originally, the individual ones I get from Maelstrom.


I can only assume these are pure sable or very high standard synthetics, what brand is it / manufacture?

You'l find that different paints will suit different painters. Many tend to get paints from different manufacturers as they have their own strengths. GW paints aren't too bad, but are a bit pricey for what you get. Vallejo is good, but come a little more watered down, which is not necessarily a bad thing depending on how you paint (you should water down your paints! but some don't like how watered down vallejo is).

I haven't personally tried P3 but I've heard good things about it too. If you can't get it cheaper than vallejo or GW which you can buy here in christchurch (Vallejo at Acorn models on manchester, GW from comic compulsion), then I can honestly say its probably not worth the effort while you're starting out. For a beginner the differences will be marginal.

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 Post subject: Re: help a guy out
PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2011 12:13 am 
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I use mainly Vallejo paints with a few GW and P3 mixed in after some advice from these forums. They are all good paints, but GW price is 2x what it should be. Vallejo requires a bit more shaking to mix the paint at first, but come in awsome dropper bottles, GW tends to dry out in the pots, but are easily available, and P3 tends to have a funny way of drying off shade and also have dropper bottles.
GW Metalics are good, but I have now been converted to Vallejo Model Air metalics!
Get yourself some GW washes. They are a painters best friend!
P3 has some good prime colours and has handy triads which help alot when picking the right colours to shade in

I got my Vallejo paints from malestrom. Worked out about $2.60 each inc shipping. I now own tooooo many

Dont cheap out on brushes. Buy the best ones you can afford. A good brush will make it easier to paint, last alot longer and help improve you skills alot quicker. learning on a cheap brush can sometimes be a hinderence to developing better painting skills as you often have to relearn the same skills if you change brush types. Rapheal and Windsor & Newton are probably the most highly recommend brushes used by pro miniture painters. You can buy Rapheal brushes at your local art supply store as they are stocked in NZ

I ended up getting Rapheal 8401's (there miniture/retouch series) for about $15-$20 each depending on brush size. Look to get a standard size, detail and fine detail (sizes are very dependant on brands, my size 3 Rapheal is about a size 0 Winsor & Newton) to begin with, then get some cheaper brushes for base/under coats, and drybrushing.

Oh, and learn to thin paints! it does wonders to the end result (and makes the paint go further). Also dont be scared to mix colours (especially for shading/highlighting). If you learn to do this you can get away with far fewer colours which ultimatley means saving $$$

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 Post subject: Re: help a guy out
PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2011 12:37 am 
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Location: You must be the jesus of gaming, you can turn wargaming into whine.
alphz wrote:
I can only assume these are pure sable or very high standard synthetics, what brand is it / manufacture?


Wouldn't have a clue what type, personally I look at the proof rather than the info. The brand is stylis, it is a Japanese brand made in China.

You can ask lots of people, because a large amount of people in chch use my brushes: bloodyweaselkick; warpmaster; wallacer; great boost; etc. all use them. Well I hope they do as they purchase them from me...

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Warpmaster wrote:
I don't beleave you AJ, we all know your a computer that shoots wonderfully painted mini's out of your butt every day

Javelin wrote:
You'll have to let us know when you're next back so that we can have AJCon.


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 Post subject: Re: help a guy out
PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2011 12:41 am 
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AJ wrote:
alphz wrote:
I can only assume these are pure sable or very high standard synthetics, what brand is it / manufacture?


Wouldn't have a clue what type, personally I look at the proof rather than the info. The brand is stylis, it is a Japanese brand made in China.

You can ask lots of people, because a large amount of people in chch use my brushes: bloodyweaselkick; warpmaster; wallacer; great boost; etc. all use them. Well I hope they do as they purchase them from me...


I wasn't questioning the quality vs price of the brush, I was more curious on what it is so I can decide if I want it :) As much as you and many other enjoy it I am specifically looking for sable brushes and $10 just sounded like they would be sable...

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 Post subject: Re: help a guy out
PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2011 12:55 am 
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AJ wrote:
Wouldn't have a clue what type, personally I look at the proof rather than the info. The brand is stylis, it is a Japanese brand made in China.


Pretty sure they're synthetic. The white/clear colour is a sign that they're synthetic. Sable tends to be a darker colour (usually the colour of the hair used)


In general synthetic brushes will have a tendency to 'curl' at the tip as they start getting worn/not looked after.
Sable brushes will last a lot longer but 'wear out' and get frayed (though this is more a sign of paint in the ferrule).


alphz wrote:
I wasn't questioning the quality vs price of the brush, I was more curious on what it is so I can decide if I want it :) As much as you and many other enjoy it I am specifically looking for sable brushes and $10 just sounded like they would be sable...


You can get Hadyn sable brushes for about $6 or so (I think they've gone up to about $7-10 now) and I've found them really good. Although I tend to not look after them due to their cheapness.

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 Post subject: Re: help a guy out
PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2011 1:59 am 
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I use a mix of stuff rather than stick religiously to one brand based on how I've found the quality and to a lesser extent on price.

For paints I'd say ditto to AJ's comments re GW standard range being poor and +1 to using Vallejo instead. I've started using their Game Colour range and they're great. The only exception to that for me is the GW metallics which unlike their colours are very good, and I still prefer them over the Vallejo ones.

The newer GW Citadel Foundation paints are great for basecoating, and also their washes particularly Badab Black and Devlan Mud are very good too.

For brushes I use all sorts. Drybrushing buggers brushes real fast so I use cheaper synthetics for that and big stuff like painting terrain, but otherwise I use Sable brushes for everything else. As someone already mentioned they are far superior for not succumbing to tip curl and I've found with a bit of care to avoid getting paint in the ferrule and an occasional clean with brush cleaner (get a tiny tub of 'The Masters Brush Cleaner') they last for ages. I pick mine up at various artist supply stores like The Drawing Room but I haven't been there in a while so unsure if it's open again after the quakes.

Also if you're getting set up for painting I'd recommend getting sorted with decent lighting, trying to paint with poor light is a bloody nightmare. You can get specialist lights but they're expensive so the cheapest way is just small desk lamps using 'daylight' or 'craft light' bulbs which give a blueish light closer to natural daylight rather than yellowish normal bulbs. You can get the bulbs from lighting stores or places like Spotlight or Smith City.


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 Post subject: Re: help a guy out
PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2011 9:51 am 
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If your painting Ogres then you will need a 2,1,0 and possably a 00 sized brush.You will also need a undercoat spray .GW make a very good black undercoat spray but its pricy.I use Plasti-Kote super matt black;its half the price of GW spray:D

Yes Ajs brushes are synthetic.I tend to stay away from synthetic brush but Ajs ones are bloody good value and don't crap out to fast.


As for paints,well i'm love using most paints,Coat de arms,P3,GW,Vallejo,Foundry,and Andrea

We will start with the paints that i know well

GW
Pros
Easy to obtain
Most colours are very good with plenty of pigment
Mix well
Great metalics,Boltgun,Mithril,Chainmail.
Foundations paints are REALLY!! good for base coating
New Inks are fantastic

Cons
Cost is stupid
Pots are terrible(dry out easy)
Some colours are rubbish
You get bugger all in a pot

Vallejo
Pros
Great value
Massive range of colours
Great pot(Eye Dropper)
Easy to obtain
Plenty in a pot(17ml)

Cons
Rubbish white and black
Some colours are way to watery with not enough pigment

Foundry
Pros
Come in a triad of 3 pots with 3 shades of the same colour
Great level of pigment and give great coverage
20mls in a pot

Cons
Hard to get hold of (Wargames Foundry and the Warstore)
Pricy by the time you add postage
Can dry with a satin finish with some of the colours

Coat de arms

Pros

Cheap
Plenty of paint in a pot(20ml)
Great range of colours

Cons
Hard to get hold off (malstrom games)
Some colours suffer from lack of pigment
Old school GW pot(Not as bad as the new ones)

I only have a few P3 paints so can't really say much about them only that some pots don't seem to have alot of pigment in them.

I'v just started using Andrea paint too ,but so far there my favorite paints.Think there licened by Vallejo too.They come in a 6 shade box set for each colour.


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 Post subject: Re: help a guy out
PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2011 11:34 am 
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DaveH wrote:
The only exception to that for me is the GW metallics which unlike their colours are very good, and I still prefer them over the Vallejo ones.



You should try the Vallejo Model Air range of metallics. I find they are even better than GW (which are still better than most). Very smooth even finish. Also get a bottle of the Model Air Metellic Medium. Mix it with any coulour you want to create a metallic effect. IMO Vallejo Model Air metellics are better than the GW

Also +1 to lighting

+1 on vallejo Black/white being rubbish. GW does the best black ive found. Ive heard P3 whites are chalky but never used them.

and my preferance is Red Sable > synthetic anyday for brushes, although I use synthetic for basing and stuff that wrecks brushes!

best bet is to get a standard size (say size 1-2) brush of each type and try them out before investing in a set. I will say again that a good brush is the most important thing for anyone painting, from beginner to pro. Dont cheap out on the brushes, treated right high quality will last 4x longer than a cheap one saving you money in the long run

I think most people are saying dont be scared to mix and match paint brands. Any of the brands warpmaster listed will be fine at the end of the day. Until you have a bit of experience and develop your painting style its hard to say A is better than B. Your best bet is to get a set of paints within your budget and learn to mix colours. I found Vallejo good for this as they do a complete range of mediums which can help add effects and thin your paints. GW unfortuatley dosnt currently have a range of mixing mediums, although thier paint range is more aimed at the beginner/casual painter to be fair

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