South Island Wargaming, New Zealand.

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 Post subject: Re: Menoth Army - Expansion Plotting
PostPosted: Mon Jul 07, 2014 11:53 am 
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Bloodyweaselkick wrote:
Imo Menoths best guns are on their jacks. I like the Reckoner and the Redeemer.


I looked at those and considered getting one instead of sunbursts. My reasoning for going with the Sunburst was to avoid focus starvation - Tristan can really only manage the one Heavy, and Kreoss has three Light jacks already; I found the current setup to be acceptable (considering the basic level of my Jacks) but pushing Focus as it is.

Still might get one though, can never have enough toys ^^

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 Post subject: Re: Menoth Army - Expansion Plotting
PostPosted: Mon Jul 07, 2014 2:17 pm 
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CruciasNZ wrote:
Bloodyweaselkick wrote:
Imo Menoths best guns are on their jacks. I like the Reckoner and the Redeemer.


I looked at those and considered getting one instead of sunbursts. My reasoning for going with the Sunburst was to avoid focus starvation - Tristan can really only manage the one Heavy, and Kreoss has three Light jacks already; I found the current setup to be acceptable (considering the basic level of my Jacks) but pushing Focus as it is.

Still might get one though, can never have enough toys ^^


You'll probably find that with the focus-independent 'jack support available to Menoth (i.e. Choir, Vassals of Menoth) that you can happily run multiple 'jacks without straining your caster too much.

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 Post subject: Re: Menoth Army - Expansion Plotting
PostPosted: Tue Jul 08, 2014 12:05 pm 
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This is the evolved list from suggestions thus far (exactly 50 points):

High Exemplar Kreoss
-Devout
-Repenter
-Revenger
Choir of Menoth (Leader and 3 Grunts)
Choir of Menoth (Leader and 3 Grunts)
Exemplar Bastions (Leader and 4 Grunts)
-Exemplar Bastion Seneschal
Exemplar Errants (Leader and 9 Grunts)
-Exemplar Errant Seneschal
Initiate Tristan Durant
-Crusader
Rhupert Carvolo, Piper of Ord
The Covenant of Menoth
Vassal of Menoth

I'm tight for cash and can't afford lots of new warjacks, this list requires me to buy a second choir, a bastion squad, two senechals and the vassal. Might swap the Crusader for a Redeemer at some point - my Light Jacks made short work of two of Javelins jacks and my Crusader did sweet **** all (though he did manage to get both Tristan and Kreoss killed); if he continues to be lacklustre I'll replace him :D

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 Post subject: Re: Menoth Army - Expansion Plotting
PostPosted: Tue Jul 08, 2014 7:35 pm 
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crusader could be swap for a templar is the one with a fail and shield.

swap the -Exemplar Errant Seneschal for the ua.

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 Post subject: Re: Menoth Army - Expansion Plotting
PostPosted: Tue Jul 08, 2014 7:38 pm 
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I don't think you need the 2nd Choir or the Revenger. If you're worried about people shooting at your choir go to a max squad but you shouldn't need to shell out the cash for a 2nd unit. The Revenger is ok but Kreoss doesn't really need to channel spells a lot and is usually better of keeping focus for his battlegroup and defenders ward/purification. That would free up 8pts for either a full unit of Zealots + UA if you like infantry heavy or a Reckoner if you prefer a bigger battlegroup.
Also while they are both good, the UA is more important than the Seneschal for the Errents imo.
Hope that helps! :)


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 Post subject: Re: Menoth Army - Expansion Plotting
PostPosted: Tue Jul 08, 2014 8:13 pm 
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Bloodyweaselkick wrote:
I don't think you need the 2nd Choir or the Revenger. If you're worried about people shooting at your choir go to a max squad but you shouldn't need to shell out the cash for a 2nd unit. The Revenger is ok but Kreoss doesn't really need to channel spells a lot and is usually better of keeping focus for his battlegroup and defenders ward/purification. That would free up 8pts for either a full unit of Zealots + UA if you like infantry heavy or a Reckoner if you prefer a bigger battlegroup.
Also while they are both good, the UA is more important than the Seneschal for the Errents imo.
Hope that helps! :)


I'm working on a budget, so my option is only $185.

That said, with two small choirs I can double up the buffs on the Jacks - got the idea from the Menoth forums. I don't have a Revenger right now - I have Reckoners and Redeemers - it was my suggestion for the future when I'm not so hurting in cash. I would have thought the Senechal was better so I can get Hunter?

Zealots do sound awesome, and I fully intend to get some (plus UA) eventually.

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 Post subject: Re: Menoth Army - Expansion Plotting
PostPosted: Tue Jul 08, 2014 10:27 pm 
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it more of splitting the buff with the choir. shoot with battle then no shooting on a jack to block los or just get in the way.

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 Post subject: Re: Menoth Army - Expansion Plotting
PostPosted: Tue Jul 08, 2014 10:45 pm 
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Troll wrote:
it more of splitting the buff with the choir. shoot with battle then no shooting on a jack to block los or just get in the way.


Sorry Troll I didn't understand that? Every model in Choir has to chant the same buff, but can pick different targets - so the only way to double buff is to have two choirs. Or am I missing something?

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 Post subject: Re: Menoth Army - Expansion Plotting
PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 10:25 pm 
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yes choir sings same song so yes only way is two choir. also people like taking choir out as they buff jacks so well so 2 of them means you keep one back or late game fun.

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 Post subject: Re: Menoth Army - Expansion Plotting
PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2014 8:17 am 
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I don't have enough points to drop the Senechal and Crusader and pick up the UA and Templar. I can drop both and pick the Templar, or keep the Crusader and get the UA for the Errants. I could do it if I also dropped the Vassal of Menoth but that guy with this list makes one of my jacks very very deadly (free extra attack and all that).

Is the loosing the Vassal worth it when picking up the Templar?

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 Post subject: Re: Menoth Army - Expansion Plotting
PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2014 7:52 pm 
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hell no vassal it gold templare is hard to kill run by tristrain but envline is so good.

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 Post subject: Re: Menoth Army - Expansion Plotting
PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2014 5:07 pm 
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If you've got a redeemer, I'd use that with Tristan - being able to just pop three focus on it from turn 1 is pure gold, whereas he has to put himself at a lot of risk to run a melee heavy.

The reason everyone is arguing for the Errant UA over the seneschal is that hunter is situational whereas pathfinder, quick work, and spell immunity are amazing. Quick work is particularly good with Kreoss's feat.

The nice thing about buying a Templar is that you can then also use the spare arms to turn your existing Crusader into a Vanquisher, which is a really nice heavy as well - the Templar box is a single jack with arms to make up a crusader, vanquisher, or templar.

I would take a second vassal first over a second choir - sure you can only ancillary each jack once, but enlivening several jacks can be amazing.

A couple of other options you haven't mentioned:

Nicia: she's my favourite combat solo, just because after playing with slow menoth melee stuff it's a total breath of fresh air to have someone who can run 14" when needed.
Wracks: you *will* end up with 1 point left over at times, so one of the 1 pt options is nice to have for listbuilding flexibility
Another caster: it's quite nice to be able to just swap someone else into your existing army and play a whole new game. I found pSeverius ran the same army as Kreoss pretty well, but felt very different, for example.


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